doubleback
novice
I rock harder than most, yet less hard than some.
Posts: 1,262
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Post by doubleback on Apr 3, 2016 18:21:44 GMT -6
So, the base he comes on IS slightly larger than a Mega Nobz base....and I do not care as he looks glorious as shit
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Post by dennish on Apr 5, 2016 11:49:56 GMT -6
Had a quick question about some stacking-cover saves issue. When at Adepticon this issue came up & I was just wondering if I was in the wrong or not.
And it's completely cool, as I want to learn on how to NOT make mistakes.
Ok, following scenario:
Leman Russ with Camo-Netting increases it's cover-save by 1 - 6+ cover-save Out in the Open Leman Russ pops Smoke, giving it shrouded - 5+ cover-save for shrouded Leman Russ is covered more than 25% by Guardsmen in it's front - 5+ save for shooting through Guardsmen
So here would be my math.. 6+ in open + Smokey Shrouded makes 4+ cover, then behind the Guardsmen turns this into a 2+ cover, if Leman Russ gets shot at?
Thanks guys!!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2016 12:35:22 GMT -6
I think a number of things are off here. Camo netting gives stealth I believe. Popping smoke provides a 5+ cover save. Intervening units provides a 5+ cover save. So at most you would have a 4+ cover save while smoke is popped, and a 4+ save while behind models. But you take the better save, they don't stack.
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Post by rogerspacem on Apr 5, 2016 13:21:34 GMT -6
Quick correction: Popping smoke only provides a +5 cover save. It is not considered shrouded (to the best of my knowledge.)
So at most you would have a 4+ Cover save if you pop smoke or behind models. It won't stack, but if you opponent is unable to see a certain percentage of your vehicle's facing arc (or where ever your opponent is shoot at) then you will add a bonus to the save (need to look up valve.)
In your scenario: the best you will get is a 4+ Save... unless you have your guards stack up on each other providing an actual meatwall then that's a different story.
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Post by Dougtrio on Apr 5, 2016 15:02:31 GMT -6
Had a quick question about some stacking-cover saves issue. When at Adepticon this issue came up & I was just wondering if I was in the wrong or not. And it's completely cool, as I want to learn on how to NOT make mistakes. Ok, following scenario: Leman Russ with Camo-Netting increases it's cover-save by 1 - 6+ cover-save Out in the Open Leman Russ pops Smoke, giving it shrouded - 5+ cover-save for shrouded Leman Russ is covered more than 25% by Guardsmen in it's front - 5+ save for shooting through Guardsmen So here would be my math.. 6+ in open + Smokey Shrouded makes 4+ cover, then behind the Guardsmen turns this into a 2+ cover, if Leman Russ gets shot at? Thanks guys!! Smoke launchers are 5+ cover Vehicle 25% obscured by models is 5+ cover Camo netting improves your cover save by 1 So 4+ cover is the best save your vehicle can get, I think. (unless is has another way to improve cover like stealth, shrouded, or an invulnerable save somehow) {psychers and venomthropes}
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Post by 1D3chan on Apr 5, 2016 15:45:00 GMT -6
Had a quick question about some stacking-cover saves issue. When at Adepticon this issue came up & I was just wondering if I was in the wrong or not. And it's completely cool, as I want to learn on how to NOT make mistakes. Ok, following scenario: Leman Russ with Camo-Netting increases it's cover-save by 1 - 6+ cover-save Out in the Open Leman Russ pops Smoke, giving it shrouded - 5+ cover-save for shrouded Leman Russ is covered more than 25% by Guardsmen in it's front - 5+ save for shooting through Guardsmen So here would be my math.. 6+ in open + Smokey Shrouded makes 4+ cover, then behind the Guardsmen turns this into a 2+ cover, if Leman Russ gets shot at? Thanks guys!! Only Stealth and Shrouded stack, other cover saves do not. In the BRB it just makes a point to say it in their specific rules entry. So as it was said, you get Stealth but the other thing (smoke) is not Shrouded, so it doesn't stack. Your Stealth (Camo netting) can stack with either the Obscured Cover Save or your Smoke Cover Save, equalling the same, so you get a 4+ cover save.
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Post by dennish on Apr 5, 2016 17:14:58 GMT -6
Gotcha Guys! OK, I guess I should have asked what saves will actually stack instead! Perfect! That makes much more sense and sounds much less OP. Appreciate the help, and this ensures that I won't make a mistake like that again
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Post by Dougtrio on Apr 5, 2016 17:31:40 GMT -6
To be clear, camo netting is NOT stealth. You can still stack stealth on top of camo netting's "1 point better than normal".
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Post by dennish on Apr 6, 2016 6:40:06 GMT -6
To be clear, camo netting is NOT stealth. You can still stack stealth on top of camo netting's "1 point better than normal". Gotcha, good to know. So hypothetical scenario; Shrouded + Stealth stacks, which gives 4+, if then smoke launchers were used, it would go up to a 2+? Man, I am hoping I am not too freaking ignorant with my math here... Also, if I were to take a unit of Bullgryns with Slabshields (and you probably know this as a fellow Guard player) & have Lemans with camo sitting behind, they would go up to a juicy 3+ right? Since Bullgryns are essentially a moving aegis-line, but add an additional +1 to the cover-save? Or, would it just be a 4+? Don't have the book in front of me, and never ever used Ogryns ever..
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Post by Nick P on Apr 6, 2016 7:18:29 GMT -6
You are correct - stealth/shrouded + smoke = 2+ cover, slabshields + camo nets = 4+.
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dex
neophyte
STATUS
Posts: 739
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Post by dex on Apr 6, 2016 10:59:55 GMT -6
Stealth and Shrouding + and 5+ cover save = 2+
I think about it like this normally, Find the best cover save the model/unit gets, example: Intervening Model 5+, in Ruins 4+ so we get a 4+ Stealth? If yes then increase the cover by 1 Shrouding? +2 Any random rule which instead of giving you a cover saves, changes your cover save. Camo Nettings, Tau Vehicle Stealth Thing.
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Post by dennish on Apr 8, 2016 6:10:36 GMT -6
Stealth and Shrouding + and 5+ cover save = 2+ I think about it like this normally, Find the best cover save the model/unit gets, example: Intervening Model 5+, in Ruins 4+ so we get a 4+ Stealth? If yes then increase the cover by 1 Shrouding? +2 Any random rule which instead of giving you a cover saves, changes your cover save. Camo Nettings, Tau Vehicle Stealth Thing. Good point too! Actually makes it easier to remember. I don't know why until now I started struggling with the rule interpretation. For some reason it was always clear to me, until I started doing stupid stuff at Adepticon with cover-saves. Which makes me think that I have done it wrong this entire time, and never noticed? Kind of feel like a tard.
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Post by Dougtrio on Apr 8, 2016 8:51:56 GMT -6
Welcome to 40k, where nobody knows all the rules. But hey, we all love how complicated and complex it is right? RIGHT?!
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Post by rogerspacem on Apr 8, 2016 15:03:23 GMT -6
Welcome to 40k, where nobody knows all the rules. But hey, we all love how complicated and complex it is right? RIGHT?! Amen to that!
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Post by dennish on Apr 9, 2016 7:55:52 GMT -6
Welcome to 40k, where nobody knows all the rules. But hey, we all love how complicated and complex it is right? RIGHT?! Amen to that! I love 40k, the game where you only learn the rules that pertain to your particular army, and when you face anything other than SM you spend 3 hours a game looking up rules..
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