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Post by Russell on May 5, 2014 15:33:39 GMT -6
Psychic Phase: Love it. That's one of my favorite parts about Fantasy.
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Post by jefferestinpeace on May 5, 2014 15:43:26 GMT -6
Psychic Phase: Love it. That's one of my favorite parts about Fantasy. That is actually pretty cool. Won't be forgetting everything anymore.
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2014 16:50:31 GMT -6
So happy there's more stuff that is made available to everyone "except Tyranids" Also, here comes my entire Ripper Swarm army because that's of course no fun at all. A 100% genestealer army could be cool though, like an invasion force.
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Post by jefferestinpeace on May 5, 2014 17:20:10 GMT -6
So happy there's more stuff that is made available to everyone "except Tyranids" Also, here comes my entire Ripper Swarm army because that's of course no fun at all. A 100% genestealer army could be cool though, like an invasion force. Genestealers are troops, so there's nothing to really stop you from doing that as it stands. Some dude over on the Tyranid Hive was running that for awhile, but without proper shooting or being able to assault from Outflank, it's got nothing.
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Post by jason on May 5, 2014 17:48:11 GMT -6
Falling on both sides here.
On one hand a massive terminator army that isn't clothed in bed sheets or Mary Sue Silver is exciting, but on the other... It's hard not to be concerned for a game system when a core mechanic is drastically overhauled... In the midst of an already tumultuous period when so much is being overhauled via data sheets and formations out the ass.
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Post by Nick P on May 5, 2014 17:52:49 GMT -6
I actually like the ideas of a psychic phase and the tactical objective cards as a way to get points other than...first blood, hold objectives, or kill points. Well see what the bonuses are for using the FoC...I can't help but think I'll build lists with it instinctively regardless.
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Post by jason on May 5, 2014 18:09:48 GMT -6
I actually like the ideas of a psychic phase and the tactical objective cards as a way to get points other than...first blood, hold objectives, or kill points. Well see what the bonuses are for rusing the FoC...I can't help but think I'll build lists with it instinctively regardless. I guess it simply doesn't make sense to force a 2 troops requirement since in war you obviously don't send your base infantry on every mission, that said I just think it potentially opens up the game to so much more abuse... We'll see soon enough I suppose.
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Post by Matt W. on May 5, 2014 18:14:36 GMT -6
I hope the unbound armies part is an elaborate prank, the rest of it is pretty meh.
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Post by Nick P on May 5, 2014 18:17:55 GMT -6
Keep in mind the fantasy book has a sort of "wild ways to play your games" section in it, and the unbound lists might just be one of them for 40k. One of those things that's intended for a fun one off game but not the core game.
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Post by jason on May 5, 2014 18:32:18 GMT -6
Keep in mind the fantasy book has a sort of "wild ways to play your games" section in it, and the unbound lists might just be one of them for 40k. One of those things that's intended for a fun one off game but not the core game. Yeah, thats another thing to keep in perspective in general I suppose, certainly don't have to play with those rules if I don't wish to. And I'm sure TO's will not be on board.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2014 9:31:19 GMT -6
The new Daemonmancy powers sound interesting. Not sure how I feel about the DA having access to it, but It definitely makes traitor guard and CSM more interesting.
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Post by jefferestinpeace on May 7, 2014 9:36:05 GMT -6
Nids be like: "That's cool guys, we'll play our own game over here. Have fun!"
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Post by Joelercoaster on May 7, 2014 10:17:23 GMT -6
There's so much up in the air at this point. WD is fairly notorious for getting things wrong... especially in Batreps, people tend to do things not to actually showcase armies, but rather just do crazy games and "forge narratives", whatever that means (hint, it means a group wank in the back room).
This "unbound" nonsense could be an optional "hey, you can do this!" thing. I wouldn't necessarily expect it to be, so much, knowing GW and the moves they've been making to "buy everything you've always wanted, you can play it all now!"
I mean, I don't even blame them for it really. And apocalypse is fun in part because you can just take your favorite toys (says the guy who always shows up with a standard 3k army because that's all he has). It boils down to, who's going to be "that guy" who brings an army of 8 Riptides? And the answer? Don't play that guy. Problem solved. You know it won't be fun, and it probably won't even be that fun for him. In a tournament, you can't just avoid players... but you expect them, generally, to bring the hardest lists they can. If you're playing in a tournament that allows Unbound stuff, you have already agreed to play against 8 Riptides and not complain about it.
I'm interested to see what happens with Psy Powers. If the book tables change, a lot of the current shenanigans could get toned down (ie, no Prescience in every army doing crazy good things). I'm not too miffed about Nids not getting the new table... we have our powers, and they're a really good set. My biggest complaint was the lack of self-allying, but that *may* be moot now anyway (if you can take however many detachments you want).
Psy phase may be cool. I mean, with a Tyrant, a Tervigon, and a brood of 'thropes, I'm rocking a d6+5 each phase. Only GK's are going to be shutting down more powers, and once we close in Shadows already does the work for us (at least the heavy lifting) so we can focus our pool on destruction rather than counter-destruction. Although I'm a bit confused as to how the whole system is meant to work (as I'm sure I'm meant to be at this point).
Who knows, I may hate it. But it could be awesome. Imagine a world where you can cast Catalyst as much as you want (with risk of Perils, of course). If the enemy doesn't or can't shut you down, suddenly that Tervigon is handing out FnP to 3 units a turn, easy. No telling if this would even be possible under the new psy phase, but it could be funsies. All of The Horror. All of it.
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Post by Nick P on May 7, 2014 10:52:17 GMT -6
Joel I don't know if you've ever played fantasy, but it sounds like the old 7th edition magic system.
Basically, on your turn, you will roll D6+5 for your "psychic power dice", and your opponent will roll his D6+X for his "psychic defense dice". You would then roll some dice, add your psychic mastery, and your opponent would roll some dice, and add his. In fantasy, spells have a casting value that you have to overcome to get the spell off - weaker spells are easier to cast (5+ say) while big spells are harder (25+ for example). Since 40k spells already don't have values like that, I'm assuming that you will simply compare your opponent's score to your own, and if you win then it goes off, if he wins then it doesn't.
You can roll almost as many dice (up to 6 probably, per fantasy rules) as you want, and he the same - but you can still only attempt to cast each power once per model (so if you have several models with the primaris for example, they can all try to cast it).
I'm assuming as well that, if the perils is moving to a table format, then it will also draw on the fantasy mechanic of miscasts - if you roll 2 or more 6s for your power, then it goes off without question, however you then roll 2D6 on a table and can get result anywhere from a S10 hit to losing psychic powers to flat out dying outright and taking half of the unit you're in with you.
This brings in the tactic of psychic power dice, ie, how to use them to draw out your opponents dice to give you easier castings later, and vice versa how to throw your dispell dice so that you don't end up with that big spell going through that your opponent is counting on. Fantasy players should have the advantage in this regard, having practice in controlling the magic phase.
tl;dr: you likely wont be casting 3 FnPs a turn with your terv; however, the nids will have an advantage as some of the spells that they can get off (warpblast, psychic scream) are so powerful that opponents will likely save their dice to defend against those, and let through a lot of the blessings etc that we have access to
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2014 11:38:48 GMT -6
It sounds like the old 7th edition magic system. I'm not sure it will work so similarly. Deny the witch will almost certainly still be a thing because it would make several rules I can think off in my own codex, the daemons codex, the inquisition codex, and the csm codex useless. Adamantium will could be changed, although I'm not sure how it would work with that system, but many Khornate daemons have a 2+ deny the witch. I also don't think that they'll do psychic defense dice because their are several armies without a psyker available to them. I imagine it would use a 1/2 and 1/2 system, the offensive side being similar to fantasy casting, but still using the deny the witch defense. I guess the could just FAQ everything though, assuming they still care to do those... TL;DR meaningless speculation
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