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Post by Nick P on Aug 19, 2014 8:24:45 GMT -6
Alright so here is the list I'm thinking of for the Indy GT next month.
NOTE: The Indy GT allows FW approved 40k units and lords of war...and you also get to ally with the same codex used in the primary, which differs from the BRB. They use the BAO/LVO rules and faqs as well.
Primary Detachment: Viable Flying Circus
HQ Hive Tyrant - Wings, lashwhip, bonesword, electroshock grubs, toxin sacs
My general, and my main counter to riptides, wraithknights, Tyranid MCs, and small elite units. At I9 and instant death on a to wound of 6, and with toxin sacs allowing him to reroll 3's to wound (at T5) and 2's to wound (at T4 and under), he'll shred grey knights, terminators, tau battlesuits, etc. Also can take just about anything but Abaddon and Skarbrand in a challenge.
Hive Tyrant - Wings, 2x Brainleech Devourers, electroshock grubs
Standard dakka flyrant. 12 S6 TL shots per shooting phase with 360 arc even when swooping - can easily have this dude just circle the battlefield blowing up infantry and light vehicles. Useful in a pinch to assault vehicles or to take objectives, linebreaker, place him in a table half/quarter that is contested (as per some of the mission special rules used at the event) in the last turn to help win the game.
Elite Zoanthrope Zoanthrope
Added MLs, good anti-tank in the midfield, additional synapse, and with 2 units of 1 they're easier to hide, have to be targeted separately, and also get to roll different psychic spells to diversify my repertoire for the psychic phase.
Troops Tervigon 30 Termagants - 18 fleshborers, 12 devourers
Obvious combo unist - an objective secured MC that can spit out 3D6 termagants per turn, dice gods willing. Only reason I didn't go 15/15 on the termagants is to save points - but even so, this unit dishes out 36 S4 shots at 18" and 54 S4 shots at 12"...talk about anti-infantry and objective holding power. This is a tough blob to tackle by most units, save for wyverns and D-weapons. Can easily mob a wraithknight or riptide to keep it still for my tyrants to kill off as well.
Fast Attack Crone
Slime template, stinger salvo, AND 4 haywire homing missiles. This is my main anti-flier from turn 1 onward - and also acts as a distraction unit to keep my hive tyrants *hopefully* alive long enough for maximum utility. And if there is any AV14 on the board (which there will be) this thing has a decent shot at disabling it in 2 turns. Also can be used for linebreaker, taking table halves/quarters, etc. Mobility and all that.
Heavy Support Exocrine Carnifex - 2x Brainleech Devourers Carnifex - 2x Brainleech Devourers
Basically my heavy lifters for removing scoring units. Each carnifex has 12 S6 TL shots per turn at 18" - can take down fliers, anything AV12 and under, and infantry units with ease. Two units of 1 means they have to be targeted separately, are easier to deploy/hide, have 2 shots at IB if I find myself having to roll, etc. Exocrine is the only ranged AP2 we have, so will be my main anti-MEQ and TEQ unit once I can get it to the midfield. If I can get these 3 dudes to the middle and keep them protected, I will have a ton of board control.
Allied Detachment: One More Tyrant
HQ Hive Tyrant - Wings, 2x Brainleech Devourers, Electroshock Grubs
Same as above. Standard dakka flyrant, can't say enough about these guys. Simply amazing.
Troops 10 Termagants - 10 Fleshborers
Min sized fleshborer squad, to make the allied detachment legal and to fill out the points. Will basically used these guys as a backfield objective holder / screen for the exocrine and carnifexes, to give them a 5+ cover save vs shooting while I advance.
Total Points: 1846 Total MLs: 11 (so D6 +11 dice per psychic phase)
What do you all think? Its not going to beat the top 3 armies in all likelihood (jetseers lists, demons summoning demons, or SM stormraven/talon pod lists), but it should be fun to play with, look good on the field, and have a decent shot at making the games competitive and fun for the opponent as well.
Then again, the barbed heirodule is legal too - so could drop the allies, the crone, and the exocrine to snag one of those instead for S10 T8 W6 and 10TL S10 AP3 shots per turn haha
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Post by jefferestinpeace on Aug 19, 2014 9:02:30 GMT -6
Are formations legal? Cause those can really tear some shit up. The Bioblast or Living Artillery are just too good. I'm recently of the opinion that Tyranid psychic stuff isn't worth the big investment you're putting into it, but I could be wrong. I never had that much Psychic might in any of my 7th lists and didn't miss it much. I just think there are diminishing returns for Nids essentially. My love affair with Zoanthropes has lessened lately.
Also, three Flyrants gets me sweaty. However, do you think you need the Crone with that much power in the air? I really like the Harpy lately, and it also gives you limited access to Spore Mines, which are phenomenal all the time. If you took a formation, you could plug some Biovores in there, but you're not really missing out on anti-Infantry.
Also, I'd put Electroshock on the Tervigon too. When you run into 3 Knights, you might wish you had it.
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Post by Nick P on Aug 19, 2014 9:45:08 GMT -6
Yeah I've been trying to find the points for electroshock on the tervigon, just to give it another use if I need it in a pinch. And I like the crone for the haywire, which allows it to target AV13 and 14 vehicles, something the hive tyrants really can't do and something that nothing else in the list can really deal with.
I agree with the psychic powers - I don't think they're really needed, and I might find myself not really rolling for the zoan powers often with the amount of dice it takes to cast a spell in this edition, but I like having that many dice to deny my opponents with and prevent them from casting their summoning spells, re-rolling invuln saves, etc.
If I drop the zoans, and add the electroshock to the terv, I have 94 points to play with. What say you? If I switch the 12 devour-gants to fleshborers I have 142...
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Post by jefferestinpeace on Aug 19, 2014 11:56:35 GMT -6
95 points is a Malanthrope.
Problem solved?
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Post by Nick P on Aug 19, 2014 13:27:07 GMT -6
Ermagerd a malanthrope! And I'll have the rules for it to back it up. I'll drop one of the devourers to a fleshborer, go down to 11/19 for the termagants, and throw in a malanthrope instead of the zoanthropes. Adds in the synapse, the shrouding of the venomthrope, and is tougher to kill.
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Post by Nick P on Aug 19, 2014 13:30:08 GMT -6
Alright so here is the list I'm thinking of for the Indy GT next month. NOTE: The Indy GT allows FW approved 40k units and lords of war...and you also get to ally with the same codex used in the primary, which differs from the BRB. They use the BAO/LVO rules and faqs as well. Primary Detachment: Viable Flying CircusHQHive Tyrant - Wings, lashwhip, bonesword, electroshock grubs, toxin sacs My general, and my main counter to riptides, wraithknights, Tyranid MCs, and small elite units. At I9 and instant death on a to wound of 6, and with toxin sacs allowing him to reroll 3's to wound (at T5) and 2's to wound (at T4 and under), he'll shred grey knights, terminators, tau battlesuits, etc. Also can take just about anything but Abaddon and Skarbrand in a challenge.Hive Tyrant - Wings, 2x Brainleech Devourers, electroshock grubs Standard dakka flyrant. 12 S6 TL shots per shooting phase with 360 arc even when swooping - can easily have this dude just circle the battlefield blowing up infantry and light vehicles. Useful in a pinch to assault vehicles or to take objectives, linebreaker, place him in a table half/quarter that is contested (as per some of the mission special rules used at the event) in the last turn to help win the game.EliteMalanthrope Adds in additional synapse coverage, as well as the shrouding effect of the venomthrope, but in a much tougher to kill package. Plus a cool model, and something new and different that many of my opponents won't have seen, so will make games more fun and interesting.TroopsTervigon - electroshock grubs 30 Termagants - 19 fleshborers, 11 devourers Obvious combo unist - an objective secured MC that can spit out 3D6 termagants per turn, dice gods willing. Only reason I didn't go 15/15 on the termagants is to save points - but even so, this unit dishes out 36 33 S4 shots at 18" and 54 52 S4 shots at 12"...talk about anti-infantry and objective holding power. This is a tough blob to tackle by most units, save for wyverns and D-weapons. Can easily mob a wraithknight or riptide to keep it still for my tyrants to kill off as well.Fast AttackCrone Slime template, stinger salvo, AND 4 haywire homing missiles. This is my main anti-flier from turn 1 onward - and also acts as a distraction unit to keep my hive tyrants *hopefully* alive long enough for maximum utility. And if there is any AV14 on the board (which there will be) this thing has a decent shot at disabling it in 2 turns. Also can be used for linebreaker, taking table halves/quarters, etc. Mobility and all that.Heavy SupportExocrine Carnifex - 2x Brainleech Devourers Carnifex - 2x Brainleech Devourers Basically my heavy lifters for removing scoring units. Each carnifex has 12 S6 TL shots per turn at 18" - can take down fliers, anything AV12 and under, and infantry units with ease. Two units of 1 means they have to be targeted separately, are easier to deploy/hide, have 2 shots at IB if I find myself having to roll, etc. Exocrine is the only ranged AP2 we have, so will be my main anti-MEQ and TEQ unit once I can get it to the midfield. If I can get these 3 dudes to the middle and keep them protected, I will have a ton of board control.Allied Detachment: One More TyrantHQHive Tyrant - Wings, 2x Brainleech Devourers, Electroshock Grubs Same as above. Standard dakka flyrant, can't say enough about these guys. Simply amazing.Troops10 Termagants - 10 Fleshborers Min sized fleshborer squad, to make the allied detachment legal and to fill out the points. Will basically used these guys as a backfield objective holder / screen for the exocrine and carnifexes, to give them a 5+ cover save vs shooting while I advance. Total Points: 1849Total MLs: 7 (so D6 +7 dice per psychic phase)What do you all think? Its not going to beat the top 3 armies in all likelihood (jetseers lists, demons summoning demons, or SM stormraven/talon pod lists), but it should be fun to play with, look good on the field, and have a decent shot at making the games competitive and fun for the opponent as well. Then again, the barbed heirodule is legal too - so could drop the allies, the crone, and the exocrine to snag one of those instead for S10 T8 W6 and 10TL S10 AP3 shots per turn haha Updated with the new list
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Post by Nick P on Aug 19, 2014 14:52:18 GMT -6
95 points is a Malanthrope. Problem solved? Just checked - malanthrope is only 85, so I can actually increase the # of devourers in my termagant unit to 13. Woohoo dakka!
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Post by jefferestinpeace on Aug 19, 2014 15:12:49 GMT -6
Ugh, fucking amazing unit.
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Post by Joelercoaster on Aug 19, 2014 18:56:27 GMT -6
I would worry about Synapse coverage. "Oh, you silly yet delicious boy," you are thinking to yourself, "I have 3 flyrants. Three!!"
Personally, I have found these to often outpace the rest of my gribblies. While all of your big bugs will not have to worry about beating themselves to death, there is the chance that you will lose out on their shooting, ie, their only real purpose.
Aside from the fexes headbutting things a d3 times really, really quickly.
Also, pretty sure the Tyrant is only I5 base, making him I8 with the Lashwhips. Still, pretty boss. Just not as boss as Dark Eldar.
You'll definitely be an air-threat, and you have the tools to hit about anything else. If only a Tyrant could take Crushing Claws, life would be dandy, no?
In the escalation league, I started to suffer pretty hard when I stopped increasing the broodling units, in favor of going big-bug heavy. Maybe it was just me, but I really missed having those in my list, and the tactical advantages they can provide. The one Tervigon spawning was not enough to make up for not having them up front. Shrug.
Also, maybe consider CC's on the momma-bug. Along with the Shock-grubs, it turns it into a decently-legitimate threat vs vehicles. Sure, it's an MC with base S5, because why wouldn't Tyranids have terrible things, but that starts to mean a real threat to any walker (even a knight... if you're in cover... and it charges you...).
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Post by Nick P on Aug 20, 2014 8:10:57 GMT -6
Joel that is my main concern as well - in the 1850 games I've played with you fools, the 2 tyrant, 1 crone, but more gribblies has always proven useful. Even when those gribblies have been hormagants and warriors, which is just insane. Could you imagine if I used actually decent units, like more termagants and a malanthrope?
I could drop the allies all together and add another tervigon and another 30 block of termagants to the main force. Would give me 3 air units (maybe i switch the warlord to a dakka tyrant as well...le sigh...), 2 spawning MCs, and 60 infantry to screen my deployment for a 3+ cover save with the shrouding from the malanthrope.
Thoughts? I really should just start playing games out to see what works and what doesn't. I'll be looking to get like SO MANY games in this weekend at wanderers, and would love to play saturday if anyone wants to host.....
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Post by jefferestinpeace on Aug 20, 2014 8:24:32 GMT -6
I'm of the "fuck the gribblies" school these days. I've been enjoying an HQ Tervigon and Rippers for my Troops and haven't looked back. However, you can't disregard the bubble wrapping, and I think tarpitting is probably our most effective tactic against Knights, but unless you're spamming Devilgaunts, that BS3 just falls flat for me. And, as much as I feel like they should work well, it seems like most opponents can just ignore the swarm and focus down the big 'uns, as they would in an MC-heavy list anyway. The gribbs just don't ever hit hard enough for any points cost in my experience.
You know Malanthropes come stock with Regeneration? What the holy fuck is this thing?
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Post by Nick P on Aug 20, 2014 8:37:30 GMT -6
Its got the wounds of a venom and 2 zoans, with the synapse and spore cloud of both, for the price of a venom + pyrovore (ha, pyrovores), at T5 (suck it krak missiles) with a 3+ and regen. That's what.
Oh and can dish out preferred enemy if you play your cards right, and negate a challenge if the situation calls for it.
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Post by Joelercoaster on Aug 20, 2014 11:52:31 GMT -6
Nick, buy 3, then give me one.
The inability to tarpit is what really shafted me in games where I say "I miss hordes". A big blob of hormagaunts can rip into something halfway decently well... but they're really there to be a soak-bullet. Get shot? Who cares, they're cheap. Tie up a 400 pt knight for 3 turns with a 100 pt unit? Solid. Tie up a riptide ALL GAME when half of them have already been blown away? Better. It's a whole form of board control, based on paying ~100 pts to shut down 3 times that amount over the duration of the game. And maybe do some wounds to boot.
PS - Err body get ready for GK's and their brand new thing - RANGED FORCE WEAPONS.
Yeup. As if there was already a reason to NEVER BRING anything with T4 and multiple wounds, now there's even less of one. Most of the time we'll be relatively safe, but the Heavy Psilencer has, so I'm told, a 40% chance of gibbing a t6 3+ baddie per round (that's 12 shots, y'all). So each basic psilencer is a 20% chance. TOO BAD YOU CAN ONLY TAKE 4 IN A PURGATION SQUAD. No idea on points, though.
Good thing we can deny, and Shadows makes it super hard for the enemy psykers to manifest their powers!
Luckily psycannons are still good enough (multi-shot S6) that they'll be a popular choice, I should think. The 'lencers are S4, no ap, 6 or 12 shots, depending on if it's personel carried or dread-mounted. So enough shots to hurt light infantry, and also enough to pound into multi-wound characters and force them to fail just that one save.
Shrug. Malanthropes do seem cool, though. If only they had psychic powers, they could completely replace our elites slot.
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Post by Nick P on Aug 20, 2014 13:20:58 GMT -6
The psilencer is 10 pts for a normal squad and 15 for a terminator squad, I believe. Psycannons are salvo now, so are just about useless on anything not terminators thanks to relentless.
And psychic powers are still hard enough to cast that I doubt we'll see a lot of force going off; at least its not nearly as automatic as it was in the last edition(s).
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T1m
new guy
Posts: 302
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Post by T1m on Aug 20, 2014 13:59:45 GMT -6
I can vouch for the psilencer being highly disappointing. The number of shots it puts out are impressive, but it has no AP and is generally not terribly successful. Or else my dice are cursed.
I will say, that having a small allied force with a level 3 librarian in terminator armor (only 135 points!), a terminator squad and a dreadknight, deep striking first turn is rather appealing.
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