Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 25, 2017 12:44:18 GMT -6
So how's combat work in AoS? Is it just "we all swing at once" barring special rules (I'm sure there will be 'strike last' and 'strike first' rules for certain weapons - power fists and power lances come to mind)? I'm less ecstatic about that, but of course that's with an eye on the current rules where certain units use their speed as survivability (aka hormagaunts/stealers). Flat "I hit on X+" in combat is certainly streamlined, but... good? Again, depends on other rules... will modifiers be common? I do like the idea that how good your opponent is alters how often you hit in combat. On the other hand, I love that a 2+ to hit is now a thing. Basically I want a Hive Tyrant to be scary in combat again. That is all. Good day. The player who's turn it is selects one unit in any combat to fight, it then fights. Next, the opponent selects one unit in combat and fights. Players continue alternating like that until all combats are resolved.
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jesse
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Post by jesse on Apr 25, 2017 12:50:42 GMT -6
That said, it's still very unclear, though, how striking order will be resolved in combats given that AoS's combat doesn't account for units always striking first, as charging units are now supposed to. So, who knows how it will end up working.
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Post by Joelercoaster on Apr 25, 2017 12:56:15 GMT -6
Okay, so not a direct port. Hmmm.
My guess is it's been streamlined to "everybody roll your dice", with a few instances of "goes first/last" to keep things like Banshees/Powerfists special. Will need to see the system as a whole though.
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Post by Nick P on Apr 25, 2017 13:01:13 GMT -6
That said, it's still very unclear, though, how striking order will be resolved in combats given that AoS's combat doesn't account for units always striking first, as charging units are now supposed to. So, who knows how it will end up working. I thought AoS did have chargers striking first? Although I guess activating a unit first is more or less the same thing or can be. I wonder if initiative is now a product of the weapon itself? Or if it will just be all chargers go first, then the other player goes, then alternate (but within each combat). That would make multi charges on a single unit powerful and bring movement and strategy surrounding that phase into the forefront which I'm all about.
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jesse
neophyte
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Post by jesse on Apr 25, 2017 13:12:44 GMT -6
In AoS, the person doing the charges gets to pick the first fight, but if they charge more than one unit, then they all won't get to strike first. For example, if Person A charged units B and C into units 2 and 3 respectively, then Person A could choose unit B to strike, then Person 1 would likely choose unit 3 to attack unit C before it can attack, then unit C attacks, then unit 2. Of course, this is very simplified, but that's basically how AoS "initiative" works: you alternate picking units in potentially completely different combats.
I suppose they could do AoS combat with some modifiers, like chargers go before the alternating choices begin or a player can choose to activate all charging units at the same time.
Also, have they mentioned retreating from combat? Because that is something that could really mess up close combat armies. I charged the riptide and did seven wounds! Oh no, it retreated and now my unit's there, out in the open, getting shot to pieces.
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Post by Nick P on Apr 25, 2017 13:34:52 GMT -6
They said it will work like battleshock - so the riptide will take 2d6-LD additional wounds. Idk if there will also be a retreat mechanic or not-but if there is I'd assume there's also a sweeping advance mechanic.
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jesse
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Post by jesse on Apr 25, 2017 13:43:20 GMT -6
Battleshock doesn't actually affect monsters (you lose D6 + # of models killed - bravery models, so individual monsters never have to take it). That said, the 40k mechanic might be different.
And with retreat I meant the AoS mechanic where units can attempt to leave combat, but sacrifice the ability to shoot and charge that turn, not a morale thing. My impression is the only time you can't really retreat is if you're sort of surrounded.
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Post by Nick P on Apr 25, 2017 18:53:40 GMT -6
More gems from twitter:
- Alternate activation rather than initiative, not yet clear if that's on a combat level or gamewide level like AoS - Chapter tactics and traitor legion tactics are still in, and IG still use platoon structure - flyers have special rules on their stat sheet but are otherwise treated as every other unit, no separate "flyer type" - no scatter die - psychic phase works totally differently but will be revealed later on in another post - cover saves are cumulative with armor saves like in AoS - chaos and imperium books are veeery similar to grand alliance chaos and order from AoS - xenos will work different, more granular, not a 1:1 comparison to death, destruction, etc.
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Post by Asyrean on Apr 26, 2017 8:29:22 GMT -6
More gems from twitter: - cover saves are cumulative with armor saves like in AoS Cool. I'm glad you mentioned this. I was wondering how Cover saves might work, and if it would be similar to SW:A's system. Since I've never played AoS, can someone advise how they work in AoS? How are they cumulative with Armor saves? Just curious!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2017 8:35:49 GMT -6
More gems from twitter: - cover saves are cumulative with armor saves like in AoS Cool. I'm glad you mentioned this. I was wondering how Cover saves might work, and if it would be similar to SW:A's system. Since I've never played AoS, can someone advise how they work in AoS? How are they cumulative with Armor saves? Just curious! If you are on, in, or behind cover you get +1 or in rare cases +2 to your armor save.
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Post by Joelercoaster on Apr 26, 2017 8:46:30 GMT -6
So modifying armor instead of to-hit (which without doing math is probably close to similar effect... until you account for AP... but whatevs).
I hope this doesn't mean a lascannon can ignore cover virtue of having a great AP value... sure you could argue that it can blast through a bush easily (and it would) but cover is taking into account being seen at all (think stealthsuits/lictors). Do not waste the mighty emperors holiest of energy cells!
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Post by mcsardo on Apr 26, 2017 10:23:29 GMT -6
Separate damage stats in the weapons profile (like AOS). I imagine this will replace the "doubling out" mechanic then, since powerful weapons have the ability to cause multiple wounds with one hit.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2017 10:40:22 GMT -6
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Post by Russell on Apr 26, 2017 10:42:04 GMT -6
I hope this doesn't mean a lascannon can ignore cover virtue of having a great AP value According to this the lascannon has a -3 modifier so it basically ignores any save lower than 3+. Can't hide behind a wall when a lascannon can just blast through it.
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Post by Russell on Apr 26, 2017 10:42:19 GMT -6
ah fuck will beat me to it.
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