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Post by Joelercoaster on Jun 18, 2014 16:06:42 GMT -6
Tyranid Army Rules
Instinctive Behavior - Hunt, Feed, Lurk.
In Synapse Out of Synapse, Check Failed Out of Synapse, Check Passed Hunt Unit may re-roll 1's to hit when shooting Unit may not move, and may only fire at the nearest targetable enemy unit Act as normal Feed Unit may re-roll 1's to hit in combat Unit must move toward, and attempt to assault the nearest enemy unit. Must run if assault is impossible. Act as normal Lurk Unit gains stealth Unit falls back Act as normal
Synapse Creatures themselves, when taking a wound that causes Instant Death, instead take 2 wounds.
Shadow in the Warp: When an enemy Psyker is within synapse range, psy tests are made at -1 (ie, require a 5+ to succeed) OR ignore the first successful die when casting a power (want to run math on these, to see actual statistical effects, and math on making it cumulative to # of Synapse Creatures in range).
Warlord Traits 1: Nature's Bane - at the beginning of each movement phase nominate 1 piece of terrain within synapse range. This terrain is difficult and dangerous for all enemy models this turn. 2: Heightened Senses - Warlord and units within synapse range gain preferred enemy USR 3: Synaptic Lynchpin - Same 4: Mind Eater - +1 VP for killing an opponent in a challenge (maaaaaybe +2? Powerful, but want to differentiate from the book tables) 5: Digestive Denial - At the beginning of the game nominate 1 piece of terrain (primarily) in the enemy deployment zone. Its cover save is reduced by 1. 6: Adaptive Biology - Warlord gains Feel no Pain and It Will Not Die (again, FNP alone is good, but wanted to differentiate between the book tables)
Tyranid Psychic powers At the beginning of the game, any Tyranid Psyker may opt to roll for one less power on the Hive Mind Powers chart. If so, that model gains Warp Field for the duration of the game. This does not hinder Psychic Devotion (or whatever it's called), so each Tyranid Psyker will receive the Dominion power, even if no powers are rolled for. Note that because the Broodlord does not roll for The Horror, it can *not* opt to trade it in for Warp Field.
Note - Warp Field becomes a 4++ (these dudes are T6, mind you).
During the Psykic phase, the Tyranid army does not generate the normal d6 warp charge (however, be sure to always roll for your opponent's pool). Instead, automatically add one warp charge to your pool for each synapse creature that has not been destroyed. Further, if any Tyranid rolls 2 or more 6's when attempting to manifest, it does not suffer a normal Perils of the Warp. Instead, it takes a single wound with no saves of any kind.
Weapons n Junk
Rending Claws - AP5, Rending (5+)
Devourer w/Brainleech 18" S5 ap- Assault 6 Deathspitter 24" S6 ap5 Assault 3 MC Deathspitter 24" S7 ap 4 Assault 4 (15 points, instead of 5) Rupture Cannon 48" S10 ap 4 Assault 6 Shock Cannon 24" S5 ap5 Assault 1, Blast, Haywire (free swap for Impaler Cannon) Venom Cannons Gain the following firing mode options - Assault 1 Template, Assault 2
Thorax and Carapace weapons, and Flesh Hooks, gain the following - Twitch-Trigger Firing T-TF - Weapons with this rule may be fired in addition to the normal amount of weapons usually allowed by this model
Biomorphs n Junk
Acid Blood - Replace S5 ap2 hit with "suffers a wound" OR nix the Initiative test Acid Maw - confers AP2 in combat Regen - 20 points Toxic Miasma - Happens at the init 10 step
Tail Biomorphs, 10 points. Available to the same models they are now, except the Prime may take the Pincer. Bone Mace - may make a bonus attack with S10 ap2, Armorbane Prehensile Pincer - model gains +1A Thresher Scythe - models equiped with this tail inflict d3 S4 AP4 hits with the Rending special rule at the Initiative 2 step Poison Stinger - model gains a bonus attack with S2 ap- poison 2+
Additional Biomorphs available to MC's Extended Carapace - +1 sv. May not be taken if the creature has the Wings biomorph. 20 pts Reinforced Chitin - +1 W. 15 pts
Bio-artepharts Norn Crown - 30 points Reaper of Obgyn - gains AP2 Maw Claws - does not replace a set of ScyTals Miasma Cannon - gains the Assault 2 shooting profile
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Post by Joelercoaster on Jun 18, 2014 19:25:35 GMT -6
Alright, so as a followup I'm going to provide some INTENSE INSIGHT into the basis for my ideas so far. This is the army-wide stuffs, there will definitely be some changes to individual units (most things will go under the knife at least a little, and yes, there will be some debuffs mixed in, don't you worry your pants).
Army Wide: Synapse needs and overhaul. Compared to Ork Mob Rule, which is great, you have an even lower base Ld (with no sgt option) but get fearless no matter how many casualties you take (unless those casualties are the synapse creatures, but whatever). And *then* you start to go crazy if you're out of synapse on top of it, with a laughable bonus on a lucky 6. I wanted something that gave you a real, useable boon if you maintained a proper synapse web, but makes your army fall apart (ie, your opponent starts to dictate its actions) if you go animalistic. Your hormagaunts won't eat themselves, but they sure will charge right at that land raider, or move right into rapid-fire range of those fire warriors.
Also a bit of a boost to Synapse Creatures themselves. EW is a bit much, especially with such a focus on multi-wound models. But no one ever likes Warriors, because 3W is meaningless when every S8 thing looks at them. This is a nice little middle ground that allows them to still get b*tchwhipped by a leman russ, but still have a nifty special rule that makes you say "hey, warriors aren't complete garbage".
Shadows got two things - a) useful. I'm partial to the "lose a success" version off hand, as it means you can never try casting a power with 1 die - you will *always* risk perils. B) linked its range to Synapse. Making the Norn Crown, or Lynchpin, that much more effective for the army.
The Nid Psy Phase got a pretty big overhaul as well. Easy to calculate and keep track of - the idea is that they're not using the warp at all, and those rule make no sense for them (FLUFF!). It further creates the theme of Synapse Creatures supporting the swarm in all manner of ways, makes them more of a target for the enemy (every part of the army weakens as they go down, every part strengthens when they're alive an in number). It also says "hey, taking warriors isn't garbage" as it's the cheapest way to pump up your psy pool. Oh my gosh, it's almost like I want there to be a reason to use the unit that's supposed to be seen all the time, but never is. Further, the option to trade a power for Warp Field seems a fitting way to "buy" an invulnerable for your most important creatures. It's not like our powers are bad at all, so it's a real trade-off, especially as, if you're taking warriors, you'll have a lot of Charge to play with (initially, at least). But when an army looks up and says "What, invulnerable saves? What are those?", you have a problem.
Warlord traits... aside from Lynchpin, which is solid for the army, there is NO REASON to ever roll on the Nid table now. So basically, don't ever do it. I wanted to focus the chart to fit the theme of the army... so you have planet manipulation on 2, a few based on synapse range, and then the "I'm a tank" on a 6.
Weapons - Talons are pointless. AP5 means something, so there. Moving Rending to a 5+ puts it about back where it was when it first came out, only for Nids, only in CC (our version of a power weapon). And look what gets rending... 40 point models, genestealers, Lictors... it makes them legit scary in combat without straight up ganking everything always. Of course, MASS rending will gank anything, but mass powerfists will, too. Rending should be a real weapon in our arsenal, especially for the cost.
Ranged stuff - Devourers got knocked to 5, to keep them as an anti-infantry thing, but now there's a reason to take MC Deathspitters (light vehicle work). The Rupture Cannon looks hella scary with 6 shots, but remember that it's ONLY on a 200-ish point platform, at BS3, and AP4 means it can only ever HP a vehicle to death. It needs to have enough shots to actually threaten an AV10 vehicle, kay? Kay. Shock Cannons got a range boost, and they really shouldn't be a costed upgrade. They're not "better" than the Impaler in any way, they both serve different functions. Impaler is great at being rate-of-fire S8 that you can hide behind a rock and still shoot things. Shock Cannon has more versatility (still S5 blast vs infantry) and is better vs heavy armors. Different roles, is all. Venom Cannons need to not be basically worthless. A solid-shot (ie, Assault 3, again on BS3 platforms) needs to exist. Tyranids need to up the anti on their ranged AT options. Single shot things with no real AP don't count, friends. They just don't.
Biomorphs A lot of these are just pointless as is, so I've tweaked them a bit to make them do something. Likewise, Regen isn't an auto-take (I don't think, correct me if you feel differently) at 20 points as opposed to 30... so there's no reason it should cost that much. I'd say at 15 you'd probably throw it on everything. At 10 you'd just assume everything costs 10 points more than the book says, because obviously you took Regen. At 20, especially with some of the other like-costed options, it actually becomes an option. And speaking of new options, I pulled some from the 4th ed Fex that never should have gone away. A bit of utility in increasing survivability (like, you know, every other army being able to buy better armor) is a good thing.
The fancy ones - Norn crown is laughable at 40 points. Because really? Reaper really should be AP2. It's 45 effin' points. Fourty. Effin. Five. Points. Maw Claws shouldn't replace your talons, because they're claws. On your Maw. You know, just like the name? I realize that this means, combined with a tail, you can add 2 attacks and still have a gun (and maybe a thorax weapon). Go figure, Tyrants (or even Primes) may be rolling a lot of dice in combat. Like... 7-8. What? You mean Tyranids will be pretty nasty in combat? It's almost as if that's meant to be a thing... you're also pumping more and more points into not-super-cheap things for a couple of extra dice. But you know, tell me what you think.
That's the overview of the shared stuff. Carapace would make a comeback on a few other things, maybe. But those point costs would be unit-specific. Flesh hooks should really be 1 point, not 4... because why do we pay 400% more than anyone else for grenades? Oh, because they're S6? Cute, it's a 6" range and a bs3 model. With 2 shots. And no AP. Even Frag has AP. Seriously kids, it's silly.
As mentioned, I'll go through units next, once I have a chance to actually go through and write things up. It will mostly be small tweaks, and again not everything will get better. I'm looking for a proper balanced list here, not an "ZOMG I LOVE BUGS" reaction. So... that's a thing.
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Post by Joelercoaster on Jun 20, 2014 8:52:42 GMT -6
Time for some unit changes
Tyrants - Drop to BS3, access to bonus Bio-morphs. Gain Fleshhooks. Guard - as is Tervigon - Drop 5 points (improvements to Synapse make it even more support-y, and it's not a bad unit even now, but it lost utility with everything being scoring). Prime - Gain Psy Mastery Lvl 1, Flesh Hooks
Hive Guard - As is (remember in Synapse they're re-rolling 1's to hit now, so BS3 is less of a taint-kick) Zoanthropes - gain: Psychic Conduit - Current rule for their Warp Blast multiplier, and their Warp Field is increased to a 3++ (so they stay the same as now, but "fixing" considering the changes) Venomthropes - as is Haruspex - AAAAHHHAHAHAHAH... cough... I mean... BEAST MOVEMENT. Scary now, eh? That may even warrant a points increase, but it's hard to say as the current version is completely bunk. Lictors - Lots of typing... will have it's own post. Needless to say, it will be a ninja-bug. Pyrovore - gain Beast type
Gaunts of all types - as is Genestealers - gain: Alien Reflexes - May assault after running (worse than being a Beast), and do not suffer the Init penalty for charging through Difficult Terrain Brood Lord - as is Rippers - 10 pts per base. Warriors - Gain Flesh hooks
Gargoyles - as is Harpy - as is Crone - Raking Strike also adds "Vector Strikes cause d3 hits vs all targets, rather than the normal one vs non-flyers" Raveners - 4+ sv, access toxin sacs/adrenals (Cost as Shrikes), WS6, flesh hooks Shrikes - 4+ sv, flesh hooks Skyslasher Swarm - 15pts base Spore Mine Cluster - Any number of Clusters may be taken in a single FA slot, paying the points per cluster
Fex - access to new biomorphs Biovores - If first blast touches no enemy units, place 1 spore mine per biovore in the brood anywhere under the template (as a single spore brood). Do not resolve further barrages from that brood. Trygon - 160 points, access to new biomorphs Trygon Prime - 200 points, access to new biomorphs Mawloc - when DS'ing, only scatters d6". Increase to 150 points, access to new biomorphs Exocrine - access to new biomorphs Tyrannofex - access to new biomorphs
Note SC's have not be touched here. They're their own can of worms.
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Post by Joelercoaster on Jun 20, 2014 9:09:25 GMT -6
Idea for Smash - When a Tyranid MC smashes, it reduces its base attacks to 1, rather than trading *all* attacks. Meaning a decked out CC monster will get 3-4 (1, +charge, +CCW, +tail). Also remember that the majority of our MC actually can't even take 2 pairs of CCW's. Not to mention with how powerful the dual devourers currently are, and still would be, dedicating to combat should make them pretty solid on the whole.
I've tried to offer more ranged solutions to high armor (the Rupture cannon, and improved shock cannon, being the two main contenders). However, I feel that MC's in combat is iconic for Nids, and should be a viable option. Shooty big bugs will still be rocking a massive TWO attacks at best, and only ever 1 if you charge them (so walkers can still give us plenty of issues). But this allows for a decked combat tyrant or trygon to actually be able to hurt armor in combat. Go figure. It puts them back on par (for a few extra points, actually) with where they were pre-7th, which is basically where they've been since 3rd ed. Things like Exocrines can jump on a non-CC heavy thing and have a go at it, but a walker or other combat-enhanced monstrosity will actually do a good job of rolling them in combat, which really is okay (as these things also are paying a lot of points for being good in combat).
As always, THANKS FOR THE FEEDBACK so far. Slackers.
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Post by Nick P on Jun 20, 2014 12:20:04 GMT -6
So far I'm digging it; I don't know that the MC devourers need a change, though I know some may think having access to S6 and improved Anti-Tank guns will be OP.
I think using the current 7th ed way of creating psychic dice is alright, though adding 1 for each synapse creature instead of per ML makes sense. It will also mean that you don't ONLY take hive tyrants and tervigons for their ML, you can take things like primes and warriors to boost psychic potency. And with the -2 wounds instead of instant death, warriors will actually have a place in the army. That, or make them T5 for 40 points and call it a day.
Loving the change to smash, since thats our main way of treating vehicles to fiery death, and it was absolutely necessary. The heavy slots are crowded as is, so making the tyrannofex somewhat useful just adds to that, which balances out the army well. You're either going to have exocrines and tyrannofexes to do ranged AT, or carnies to pummel tanks in cc. Good.
The bio artefacts are just stupid. I say scrap the whole idea, buut thats just me...no matter how good they get with new editions or FAQs or whatevers, I'm never going to take them on principle that an organic species of alien will never use relics in the same way a chapter of space marines will. ever. /rant
I don't like that the shock gun is a blast; we're really going to struggle against flyers and FMCs unless you take 3 crones every game, which just gets boring. I'd make it assault 2, so they can pull a HP off a flyer each turn should they wish, which isn't game breaking but significantly helps that main drawback.
And I don't mind the current IB charts, I don't know that we need new ones...just means more work trying to balance things out, when in the end everything is going to be in synapse range for the most part anyways.
I'd make a change to genestealers and biomorphs - instead of giving stealers the ability to run and then assault, make adrenal glands that ability - 5th edition fleet. Then give genestealers adrenal glands in their profile at the same points cost they stand at now. Boom, useful stealers, and expensive but infinitely more useful hormagants.
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Post by Joelercoaster on Jun 20, 2014 12:35:24 GMT -6
Notes:
While I don't think people look at Devourers now and scream "ZOMGBROKEN!!!!1one", that's in part because that's about the *only* viable build we have right now. For anything that can take them. Ever.
That said, any time you have one real option, that one option typically needs toned down once others move forward to compete. As it stands, MC Devs are amazing at anti infantry, great at light armor popping, and can even start to work on "medium" armor. Dropping them down to S5 actually gives them a more designated role of anti-infantry (with some ability vs light armors). While MC Deathspitters join the fray as a mid-level buster, toting the AP4 to cull xenos, and that lovely S7 to reach out and touch most vehicles. They're also sporting a fairly impressive rate of fire. Further, the Venom Cannon family, with its single-shot option (which actually should probably go down to Assault 2) starts to actually threaten HP's off of heavier armors. It will also be a great source for anti-flyer duty, making the Crone a little more versatile in that respect, while still allowing the Crone to be the superior choice for anti-air (the cost of the HVC on the crone should probably go up 10 points or so to compensate).
I rather agree that bio-artepharts are terrible... but if you think of them as "new mutations that are very rarely seen", it's much easier to digest. Or something like the Swarmlord, where it's an incredibly bio-mass dense creation, only brought forth from a very serious stress-response by the Hive. GW really boned up trying to match them completely to the artifacts of normal armies, but the idea of something extremely rare within the fleet isn't that awful, I don't think.
I actually think that if the Shock Cannon weren't a blast, it would continue to pale in comparison to the Impaler. Being blast gives it real versatility vs infantry. Armor? Haywire. Guard? S5 ap5 blasts. Yes, you lose the option to skyfire (or snapfire at all), but I think enough other options are being added in here to give some viable answers. We still need to take Flyers to deal with Flyers, but *all* of our flyers will have real answers to deal with anything we'll see in the sky.
I really hate the current charts... I think it bogs down the game, is a huge hindrance to the army, and is just a mucky system. Personally I think my more streamlined version captures the feel of it, while allowing Synapse to be a real, tactical boost. But yeah, the idea is to stay in synapse either way. That doesn't always happen, though. I've been running into more and more problems with that lately, actually. It's almost to the point that I want to start using a walking tyrant, because my Flyrant is always off doing his own thing, leaving me with effectively one less bubble on the table.
As for old fleet... honestly I think making it army wide may be *too* good. I've been using hormagaunts a bit in 7th, and the MTC changes have actually been enough to, so far, see them hitting combat regularly. I'd love to see the ability sprinkled back in, but I don't think it needs to be everwhere, per se. Requires much testing, of course, but everything always does (said at GW never).
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Post by Joelercoaster on Jun 23, 2014 13:05:30 GMT -6
I'd make a change to genestealers and biomorphs - instead of giving stealers the ability to run and then assault, make adrenal glands that ability - 5th edition fleet. Then give genestealers adrenal glands in their profile at the same points cost they stand at now. Boom, useful stealers, and expensive but infinitely more useful hormagants. Conversely, Adrenal Glands could offer old-fleet (Ravenous Charge, maybe), *but* that would require some general toning down of shooting ability. I'd be totally down for rebranding Nids as *the* dangerous, fast-paced CC army. It would need to be pretty shite at shooting, though. Would be a much bigger re-write, but, you know, would be awesome.
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Post by Nick P on Jun 23, 2014 15:44:18 GMT -6
Yeah, but BS3 shooting on LD6 and 7 "I NEED SYNAPSE" platforms is really not that great. We're worse at shooting than every other army out there except for orks, but even they get random guns so they might accidentally shoot 48 S7 shots in a turn. We're stuck shooting rupture cannons and the like, traditionally terrible for their points.
I think giving CC geared creatures the option for fleet glands makes sense. Maybe don't give it to everyone, but I think it makes sense for hormies, stealers, raveners, and maybe some of the bigger guys like trygons, tyrants, and carnifexes which are supposed to be big CC monsters.
Would take playtesting, but I like the idea of being able to field a true CC list, foregoing shooting if I so choose, and actually making raveners useful.
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Post by Joelercoaster on Jun 23, 2014 17:54:24 GMT -6
I would say our good shooting is limited, but it's definitely there. Devourers in all forms are a solid choice. Exocrines are a good plasma platform all things considered. Acid Spray Tfex's are finally cost-effective line-breakers.
I should really throw down some old fexes to see how they fare. It just eats into heavy slots something fierce...
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