|
Post by Asyrean on Oct 4, 2016 11:22:08 GMT -6
That's also like saying "what if someone goes up against 3 players who just leave a single AV10 vehicle in the open in the middle of the board so they can get first blood". Its totally hypothetical, but unlike controlling other players' tactics, you have 100% control over whether your army has paint on it. Just my thoughts; painting is a huge part of the hobby, and this will force people to do it. Not sure that is a direct parallel. I was just trying to say that by offering a free VP, per game, could be a similar situation as First Blood. A mechanic, which a lot of tournaments seem to move away from since whoever takes First Blood has a high likelihood of taking the victory. Only in this case, it's a free VP. Further, it was just a comment/thought/alternate point of view. I've heard of other tourneys that certainly do offer some kind of points to a player with a painted army, for example in the event of a tie, the victory goes to the player with the painted army. So, I think that kind of mechanic has its place, just the 1 VP, per game, seemed a bit much. But again, just my opinion and I'll play regardless. I get that painting is a big part of the hobby. All of us do, and I think, all of us are working on getting our armies painted. Simply, the point is to weigh which is more important, a tournament with players who all have painted models, or a tournament with as many potential players as possible. Either way is fine, it's just a statement of fact that a firm painting requirement will reduce the pool of eligible players.
|
|
|
Post by Nick P on Oct 4, 2016 11:38:37 GMT -6
Right, I don't think a painting requirement is a good idea at all - but giving 1VP per game to a painted army (or giving a flat +5 battle points on the day, depending on the scoring system we use) is a great middle ground.
It allows players who don't have anything painted to still come and play, but also encourages players to bring painted models even if they are not the most optimal build, cutting down on the competitive level of the tournament as well. It also acts as a reward to those of us with fully painted armies, and gives those without something to strive to over the course of the monthly tournaments as they progress.
At the end of the day, the odds of losing the tournament by 3 points because of painting is extremely slim.
|
|
|
Post by Eric formerly Eric on Oct 4, 2016 11:40:04 GMT -6
I agree with asyrean. I think the way to do it is to have a separate, small prize for best painted army, and a fairly minor comp score to balance out fluffy vs. wac armies.
|
|
|
Post by 1D3chan on Oct 4, 2016 13:01:52 GMT -6
move away from since whoever takes First Blood has a high likelihood of taking the victory. EDIT: I can't get it to quote Asryean, it's saying Nick said that but he didn't lol. Guys apparently I suck ass at computers which is disappointing actually. I am dadcore.I would be very interested to see that statistic. My hunch is that, that is probably not true. However, I see where you may have gotten that from. If it were true, it would be more of a Correlation (not causation) - IE Players who get the first turn may have a higher percentage of victory (keyword: may); not because of first blood, but because of first 6 bloods - based on a particularly effective alpha strike / poor defensive deployment etc. Overall, once you guys participate, you will see that 1VP per game will not tilt it all that much. The way these maelstrom games are set up, with objectives on the table that are able to be scored every turn by anyone, the points scored per game per army will be very high. 1VP will translate to 5% on average, so theoretically all it really WOULD be doing was determining a tiebreaker in the event of a close game. Some Tournaments have a house rule like this "All Models have the Preferred Enemy: Unpainted Models" Special Rule... that's actually a somewhat common thing. However, that's going to translate into much, much more than 1VP per game and I'd never think of implementing that. That is an example of a poor way to handle it in my opinion. Let's give our way a try and see, we'll learn quickly if it makes a difference or not. My intuition and experience as a player is saying 'not really' but we will learn.
|
|
|
Post by Asyrean on Oct 4, 2016 13:29:16 GMT -6
I would be very interested to see that statistic. My hunch is that, that is probably not true. However, I see where you may have gotten that from. If it were true, it would be more of a Correlation (not causation) - IE Players who get the first turn may have a higher percentage of victory (keyword: may); not because of first blood, but because of first 6 bloods - based on a particularly effective alpha strike / poor defensive deployment etc. Yah, I'm just regurgitating what I've heard on the many podcasts I listen to. Cant tell you which podcast specifically, as it's been a while since I heard it come up. Probably Preferred Enemies. Anyway, I remember they were talking about previous tournaments and had a tournament organizer on who said something to the effect of 90% of the people who took First Blood won the game. (I remember he was talking specifically about Adepticon) Further, the majority of these games being very close scores where the 1 VP from First Blood was the determining factor. Basically, it is what put the winner over the top. So, this statistic (again, believe it if you want, I'm just relaying what I heard from a podcast) in conjunction with First Blood being a VP that only 1 player can win lead to tournaments modifying it or removing it. Again, who knows if it is true or not, I have no data to back it up. And, the most important point about this and 1 VP for painted models... I really, honestly, truly, from the bottom of my heart, don't care that much. As I said, I'm personally in no matter what.
|
|
|
Post by 1D3chan on Oct 4, 2016 14:10:30 GMT -6
Here we go boys. Let's hope it's the start of something great! I took a lot of the feedback to heart and implemented some of it. It's not perfect and it won't please everyone, but it will most certainly be fun. Follow this link to register and for more information: www.squareup.com/store/dice-dojo-warhammer-40k-tournaments EDIT: (You may have to copy and paste it)
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 14:26:02 GMT -6
At 1000 pts are you planning on playing on 4x4 tables?
Does the Modified CAD come with any of normal command benefits, I.E. Objective Secured and Trait re-roll?
|
|
|
Post by Nick P on Oct 4, 2016 14:33:27 GMT -6
1000 points really skews the game if you ask me, that's a tiny point value for armies like Tyranids or dark eldar to be competitive, where eldar absolutely crushes with scatter bikes...but we'll see!
I do echo Wills thoughts on using 4x4s.
Also I cant make it this time but will be around for the next one.
|
|
mike
Butts
Posts: 628
|
Post by mike on Oct 4, 2016 15:13:33 GMT -6
This tournament looks really great and I plan on coming. Thanks for organizing it. Really jazzed to get in on this complimentary victory point. Also put the register URL in the opening post so people don't have to search for it. <3 <3 <3
|
|
|
Post by 1D3chan on Oct 4, 2016 15:22:06 GMT -6
This tournament looks really great and I plan on coming. Thanks for organizing it. Really jazzed to get in on this complimentary victory point. Also put the register URL in the opening post so people don't have to search for it. <3 <3 <3 Thanks Mike. I hope you're being serious!
|
|
|
Post by 1D3chan on Oct 4, 2016 15:28:46 GMT -6
At 1000 pts are you planning on playing on 4x4 tables? Does the Modified CAD come with any of normal command benefits, I.E. Objective Secured and Trait re-roll? I actually have not decided on the 4x4 vs 4x6 yet. If I get 4 participants, I might make bigger boards. If it's 8, probably 4x4's. Yes, all troops are objective secured in the modified CAD. Warlord Traits will be randomly assigned (picked from a hat) and will also be custom - actually a lot like the hero forge! So while there won't be a re-roll, They will all be very good, more potent than any of the GW ones. Whichever people choose, they will be happy with because it will make their army considerably better. They will also benefit troops/soldiers more than Heroes/Deathstars. They all will all be army buffs. They will add to the fun I'm hoping. An entire army might be fearless for the day, for example. I have to work on the specifics.
|
|
|
Post by 1D3chan on Oct 4, 2016 15:33:35 GMT -6
1000 points really skews the game if you ask me, that's a tiny point value for armies like Tyranids or dark eldar to be competitive, where eldar absolutely crushes with scatter bikes...but we'll see! I do echo Wills thoughts on using 4x4s. Also I cant make it this time but will be around for the next one. I will have to see! If I need to put further restrictions on top tier codices, I might for the next one. I am not convinced anyone will abuse this though. Some lists will get +1VP right off the bat. If they're painted, even more. I mean a fully painted Dark Eldar Army is definitely starting with a leg up.
|
|
mike
Butts
Posts: 628
|
Post by mike on Oct 4, 2016 15:41:02 GMT -6
This tournament looks really great and I plan on coming. Thanks for organizing it. Really jazzed to get in on this complimentary victory point. Also put the register URL in the opening post so people don't have to search for it. <3 <3 <3 Thanks Mike. I hope you're being serious! Oh gosh yeah, I sounded really sarcastic there, but I am definitely sincere about going (and the victory point).
|
|
|
Post by 1D3chan on Oct 4, 2016 16:45:43 GMT -6
mike is officially customer #000000000000000001
|
|
|
Post by Joelercoaster on Oct 4, 2016 17:47:15 GMT -6
If by some grace of fate I'm free that Saturday, it sounds like a fun shindig. I've been down for smaller games lately.
Granted, my Dark-Eldar-are-actually-Corsairs are not what I'd call "tournament friendly"... infantry are WYSIWYG (technically), but I've been proxying vehicles so far until I figure out a good conversion that I like.
Any chance Nids can squirm onto the +1VP list? Just sayin'.
|
|